[ANNPRMEOW] Hard Eight

[Kyle]

This is the discussion thread for the All New Nerd Pride Radio Movie of the Every Other Week!

This thread is only for those who have seen the movie recently. Commentary from people who haven't seen it will be deleted.

This Every Other Weeks Movie: Hard Eight, selected by Zombie

WARNING- ALL SPOILERS FOR THIS MOVIE ARE ALLOWED! For real, if you haven't seen it, don't read any further!

Discuss!

[Phoebe]

I've seen this one a few times now and looooove it. We have fully incorporated the "f***** up situation" lingo into the vocab of daily living. A classic.

[poorpete]

[Tahlvin]

It just didn't do it for me. I about stopped watching a quarter to halfway through the movie, but kept watching hoping it would improve, but wasn't really rewarded with an improvement. Just not my cuppa tea.

[Kyle]

If people didn't like a movie, I'm interested in knowing why.

I liked this movie. I didn't love it, and it's probably my least favorite of the PTA movies I've seen, but it was good. The performances here were the standout. John C. Reilly gives a great, understated performance without hitting the "dumb guy" too hard. Surprisingly, I forgot that Gweneth Paltrow used to actually act and was perfect in this role. It was also refreshing to see Sam Jackson doing something like his normal badass, but with an insecurity to him. But y'all- Phillip Baker Hall freaking kills it. So great and nuanced for a "straight guy" performance. Such restraint-- so great.

That said, the plot is so slight. I like that we got an explanation for why Syd's helping this oaf. And I liked how Syd's past presents itself in the end (Hint to Jimmy- don't blackmail a killer). But it was still slight. Almost like what should have either been: (1) a short stage play; or (2) extended out to give more depth. Because that was my problem. The depth of the characters is hinted at, but not explored. And I understand that is the point, but it felt underserved to me.

Still, a good movie that I would recommend.

[buckett]

Borderline masterpiece, one of the best gambling-adjacent movies ever. Mostly a character study of GOD Phillip Baker Hall, never better, but really everyone is great. I particularly like Jackson's performance, he comes off as a slimy huckster to me, like someone pretending to be a "cool" Samuel L. character but is really just a phony. Phillip Seymour Hoffman's brief cameo is, as usual, *chef's kiss.*

The minimal plot works fine for me, because the runtime just flies by. No scene is extraneous. By the end of the movie I think we have complete understanding of Sydney's motivations, and the movie is really all about him, but we also have a great understanding of John's and Clementine's too. These are characters ready and willing to take dumb risks (betting Hard Eight) in an effort to break out of the monotony of their lives. Jimmy is really the only character who isn't fleshed out to me, but who doesn't know a million guys like him?

As poorpete noted the score is perfect, the neon-soaked tracking shots are a joy. It's incredible that PTA was this good this early. Great film.

[Zombie]

I have to admit I cheated and picked a movie I hadn't seen. But I did get approval from Buckett first that it didn't suck before picking it. This was the only PTA movie I hadn't seen and had been on my watch list for a while. Crazy how talented PTA is even for his first film. He's always been good with his cast, winning multiple ensemble awards for his films, so it didn't surprise me that everyone was great in this. What did surprise me was how polished the movie felt. There's not many wasted scenes, it's deliberately paced, and major character reveals felt natural and perfectly timed.

This movie ultimately is carried by Philip Baker Hall. He's awesome as a retired mobster that, as we slowly realize, makes up the fabric of his character. You can see it in the way he takes John under his wing as his protege, part motivated by guilt, and partly motivated by the disconnect with his own kids. You see it in the way he wants to buy Clementine nice things, and the fact that he has disdain for the "wall street bros" who treat and flirt with her as nothing more than a one night hooker. He's methodical in the way he gambles. Small, smart bets. The Keno scene! The only two times we see or hear about him betting big (Jimmy's flashy story about Sydney and the excellent Philip Seymour Hoffman scene), it seems out of character for Sydney. It felt like, in those moments, he was trying to reactivate a level of excitement that he's lost in retirement. Interestingly, he loses both times perhaps suggesting that the large bets aren't fulfilling. I think there's a part of him that misses the thrill of killing. It's not something that he can easily escape even if he might feel guilty of the consequences. Maybe that's what the last scene is hinting at as he covers up the blood stains while at the same diner he first met John.

Funny that he finally gets the money won on betting hard eight only after killing Jimmy. Also note to Jimmy: if you're going to hustle someone, don't hustle an ex mobster.

[buckett]

[poorpete]

Ebert says Syd is a straight-talker, but I don't think that's true. He is calm and thinks through his words, but that doesn't make him truthful. He has a ruse, that Syd is just a father figure to John and no more, an honorable ruse, but one that requires him to kill another guy to uphold. The hiding the blood at the end, exactly, he can't escape it, and he's only pretending to others it doesn't exist. I don't even think Syd loves John, I think he's lying with his admission to him at the end, but he knows John needs to feel loved. John is so desparate he marries Clementine after she said he loved him. John is desperate, Syd has guilt, so Syd fills that gap.

He exudes chill to hide his guilt, to maintain the ruse, like Jimmy exudes cool but isn't really.

So, Hard Eight means taking a risk on an already existing risk? Like Syd risking everything to uphold a risky relationship with a man he orphaned?

[buckett]

I personally think that he was motivated by guilt at first but he has really grown to love John by the end of the movie, but that's really well put and I can see your reading too.

Post your PTA rankings if you have em. Of course, all of these are all great to me regardless of ranking. I still haven't seen Inherent Vice sadly:

Tier One

There Will Be Blood
Punch Drunk Love
The Master

Tier Two

Hard Eight
Boogie Nights

Tier Three

Magnolia (blasphemous, I know)
Phantom Thread

[Kyle]

My problem with ranking PTA is that I haven't seen some of them in a while. So I'd probably start it this way: Boogie Nights; Magnolia; Punch Drunk Love. But I don't really know without rewatching those.

My family is going camping for over a week. I think I'll watch PTAs movies again while they're gone and give the definitive ranking that everyone can rely on.

Oh, and I haven't seen The Master or There Will be Blood.

[Tahlvin]

[Zombie]

[poorpete]

Here's my PTA ranking of what I've seen and how many times I've seen them, so incomplete. And obvs I'm missing seeing a single one from the last decade.

There Will Be Blood (two views)
Boogie Nights (three views)
Magnolia (two views - though I do own the Aimee Mann soundtrack)
Hard Eight (one view)
Punch Drunk Love (one view)

[Zombie]

My rankings:

There Will Be Blood
The Master
Punch-Drunk Love
Boogie Nights
Hard Eight
Magnolia (I haven't seen this in 10+ years, really due for a rewatch)
Phantom Thread

I lied earlier. I forgot I hadn't seen Inherent Vice yet. It's available online and I keep forgetting to watch it.

Related note, I haven't seen it but you might be interested, poorpete, since you are big into music. PTA's only documentary, , stars Jonny Greenwood and Israeli composer Shye Ben Tzur as they create/celebrate music together in India. I think its available online but behind a paid service.

[buckett]

[Mike]

I'm not a fan. I've seen Magnolia, Boogie Nights, and There Will Be Blood, and thought they were all just okay.

I think Punch Drunk Love is a masterpiece.

I've never seen anything else he's written.

[Kyle]

[Mike]

[Kyle]