Trump

[poorpete]

Impeachment would be great but still very unlikely, resignation would be great but go against his MO.

Since the latest offense is about the election, than the solution should mimic a quote from LBJ:

"I shall not seek, and I will not accept, the nomination of my party for another term as your President."

[FlameBlade]

Just impeach, and force senators to put their votes on records. Do it few times.

[Phoebe]

Yes, nothing prevents them from doing it more than once if something new comes out, because that's the pattern we've come to expect. At this point it is important that all the Republican Senators who would vote no have that vote recorded for posterity so that they can never again escape responsibility for it. Some of them plan to have careers in politics for a very long time, and they all deserve to have this tarnish it, which eventually one must hope it will. I don't want to hear any of them saying how much they objected to Trump this way and that way when we all know that they wouldn't have voted to remove him from office.

[Mike]

I have no faith that the Democratic House will pursue impeachment in any way that is productive--even with these latest charges. My best hope is that Trump self-destructs in his panic. He keeps coming close, but then always recovers because no one has the will to follow through when he's down.

He's probably going to serve out his full two terms.

[Phoebe]

This is the terror voice in my mind.

[mimekiller]

Can't wait for in one weeks' time when every single NYT or Wapo op ed just says: Yes, Trump is a criminal who should be impeached. But here's why his war with Iran is actually good, Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labor

[Phoebe]

Mime bringing the Latin to us, how and who knew?

[mimekiller]

I'm a onion!

[Phoebe]

Oh but it's not meaningful Latin? Well damn I was excited.

[poorpete]

If Nixon gets away with political crimes against opponents....
... future candidates will do the same or worse without fear of consequence
If Clinton gets away with lying under oath...
... future presidents will lie without fear of consequence
If Trump gets away with political crimes against opponents...
... future candidates, but also Trump himself with have an inappropriate advantage in his next election campaign.

Anyways, Trump should admit fault and exit the 2020 race. I think that would be the best for everyone, GOP, Dems, Democracy, and Trump.
And me.

[Phoebe]

The vertigo of reading about our climate change enhanced future is really something.

[akiva]

Apparently it’s game on.

[mimekiller]

lol pelosi ain't gonna impeach

[akiva]

Launching an impeachment investigation gives the House more legal powers to compel testimony and the like.

Whatever happens, I hope it happens quickly—the Dems have been moving slowly so far.

[Phoebe]

I find it all rather terrifying.

[akiva]

What are the chances that the transcript of the phone call has been doctored?

[Mike]

Trump is concerned about corruption and felt it was important for Ukraine to investigate, but the transcript will show that he never once offered anything in return. He never said anything directly that indicated he was putting pressure on them financially. He was merely asking from one world leader to another. Republicans will rely on the exact wording of the transcript to prove that Trump did nothing inappropriate.

This ignores the fact that a few days before this call, Trump put 250 million dollars worth of military aid to Ukraine on hold and that this fact would have loomed large over everything that was said. Remember Michael Cohen's testimony that Trump was always careful to never directly order anything criminal, however those who worked for him understood what he was actually asking for and would do what he wanted without direct orders. This is that sort of thing.

Trump puts the 250 million on hold with no real explanation. He let's Ukraine sweat for a few days. Then he calls up and Zelensky is sure it's about the money. Ukraine needs answers. But Trump says, "Actually Volodymyr, what's really on my mind right now is this Hunter Biden thing. I know Rudy mentioned it when he was over there. Yeah, I'd hate to have that sort of corruption hanging over everything. I really wish somebody could get to the bottom of it and figure out what sort of crimes Biden has his hands in... You know... or not. Maybe he's innocent, but I can't imagine how. So you should really find that out. It'll make things a lot easier going forward once that's out of the way." See! He never said anything about money! TOTAL EXONERATION!

[Phoebe]

Basically my reason to carry on is to cancel out the vote of at least one intolerably stupid person in my family, for which I somehow feel responsible. If I were a better person, how could any of them actually be saying the batshit crazy things they are saying on this day?

You guys when Obama ordered drone strikes on US citizens and ignored a half dozen of his most stirring stump speech promises, I became somehow slightly embittered towards him forever. I think he's one of the best presidents we've ever had, and yet I'm still a little salty about him. Bill Clinton gives me actual skin-crawling creeps on sight. If either of those guys had done anything like this, they would have been dropped like a hot poker before you could count to one. Why on Earth would otherwise decent people choose this hill to die on? Why are they choosing to stake their moral decency on a man to whom they owe nothing, who certainly wouldn't give them the time of day, and who is so totally undeserving of this loyalty?

EDITED: I know sooner wrote this than my phone popped this answer out at me (thank you, phone who understands me, but why did you spell 'no' the wrong way?):

[Phoebe]

After reading the whistleblower complaint I understand Nancy Pelosi a lot better. It's so hard to break down, in easily digestible human terms, even the most obvious cases of wrongdoing that warrant impeachment. And success depends totally on political communication: either most people are convinced something serious was wrong such that even the Republican Senate must be moved to act, or the Senate continues to support Trump and he stays in office, but voters can easily see the Democrats were in the right to pursue this thing and had to pursue it. What they did is the very reason we have the impeachment process in place, and I think it's pretty relatable in small, easily grasped packets. If any normal person is entrusted with someone else's money, and instead of doing what they're supposed to do with it they choose to use it for their own advantage, like as collateral on a loan or to get someone to invest with their business, it's obviously wrong, and in some cases criminal. This is a common way professionals can lose their license. Cover-ups make the guilt much worse. When matters of the greatest importance and national security are on the line, it's a massive breach of responsibility. I hope people will get that, but I also understand why Pelosi needed an issue like this one to drive it home.

[mimekiller]

Trump was testing the loyalty of the CIA agent in the oval office, a test he failed!